Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2008 19:55:00 +0200 From: the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: The_Dojang digest, Vol 15 #192 - 15 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: The Internet's premier discussion forum on Korean Martial Arts. 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Copyright 1994-2008: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Korean Martial Arts. 2,400 members. See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of The_Dojang at http://MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! Today's Topics: 1. Toi Gye (Luther Veuleman) 2. Re: training past 40 years of age, attention Mr. Burns (shimmeringlight@optonline.net) 3. Re: Toi Gye (Nathan Miller) 4. Re: training past 40 years of age (Curt McCauley) 5. World University TKD Chip (Ray) 6. Re: training past 40 years of age, attention Mr. Burns (Kimberley Warner) 7. RE: Toi Gye (Thomas Gordon) 8. Re: TKD or Hapkido schools in or very near Montclair, NJ (Christopher Spiller) (hapkido@optonline.net) 9. RE: Greetings from Temple/Waco, TX (Joseph Cheavens) 10. Toi-Gye Tul (Gordon Okerstrom) 11. Re: The_Dojang digest, Vol 15 #191; From: freddie bishop and Kimberly (Robert Burns) --__--__-- Message: 1 Date: Sun, 20 Jul 2008 18:48:22 -0700 (PDT) From: Luther Veuleman To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Toi Gye Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Not being familiar with the form, I youtubed it. (Clearing throat).... Does anyone have a good video they could post a link to? Charlie V --__--__-- Message: 2 Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2008 02:33:48 +0000 (GMT) From: shimmeringlight@optonline.net Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] training past 40 years of age, attention Mr. Burns To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Cc: shimmeringlight@optonline.net Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Bows........ Im sorry about your wrist.... I am also upset and concerned about your preparation for test ? I have to know, just what test were you taking, was the break on board(s) or brick(s), and you say it was a closed fist punch ? From what direction, jab, downward ? ??? Have you broken material before ? (with the same techniques?) As for my students, they are tested on their overall performance, which does not mean they have to be compared to everyone else or to the likes of a, "Bruce Lee" {with due respects}. Students that are handicapped, blind, paralyzed, wheel chairs... can still earn their belts... It is NOT about the test requirements, it is about the students philosophy and intent - their integrity, their perserverence and their spirit. Were you physically ready... or was this a mishap. Were you conditioned in 1) Mind, 2) body, 3) spirit ??? Hope you are well, and that does not keep your from achieving all you can be !!! Bows !! Master gregory nabel www.ShimmeringLight.org www.GNabelmartialarts.com ----- Original Message ----- From: Kimberley Warner Date: Sunday, July 20, 2008 5:06 pm Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] training past 40 years of age, attention Mr. Burns To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > At my first testing I broke a small bone in my wrist (the > scaphoid) in > two places. It was a really, really good punch ;.). I was in a > cast > for over a year because of some complications and 2 surgeries it > just > wouldn't heal. I passed my first test with flying colors, > tested the > second time with a cast from my hand to above my elbow. One of > the > judges didn't even know I had a cast on my arm during my forms > until my > instructor told the judges I couldn't punch with my left hand in > the > sparring because of it. > > I haven't been able to test since then because the doctor just > doesn't > seem to understand the importance of testing for me. I have > been > released from his care now so I will be working hard for that > next > test. Only missed 2 classes during that year. My instructor is > a > Physicians Assistant so he watches me very closely to make sure > I won't > re-injure my wrist. > > Anyway, I can't tell you the number of people that told me to > quit. I > figure the odds of getting hurt badly in TKD class is pretty > small and > I've already done that. So getting hurt twice, the odds are in > my > favor! > > Kimberley > > > On Jul 20, 2008, at 2:16 PM, Mitch Theriot wrote: > > > I didnt start until a year ago at age 45. I trained all total > about a > > year and a half 25 years ago. Ditto everything Kimberly said. > I kind > > of like the little aches as they remind me that I'm not > sitting on my > > rump like most of my "old" friends... > _______________________________________________ > The_Dojang mailing list, 2,400 members > The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net > Copyright 1994-2008: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource > Standard disclaimers apply > Subscribe or Unsubscribe: http://the-dojang.net > www.gnabelmartialarts.com [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type text/x-vcard which had a name of shimmeringlight.vcf; charset=us-ascii] --__--__-- Message: 3 From: Nathan Miller To: "the_dojang@martialartsresource.net" Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Toi Gye Date: Sun, 20 Jul 2008 21:50:27 -0500 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Hey Charlie, Master McHenry has the ITF forms available on his video site. http://mchenry.homeip.net/tangsoodo/forms.htm Nathan On Jul 20, 2008, at 8:48 PM, Luther Veuleman wrote: > Not being familiar with the form, I youtubed it. (Clearing > throat).... > > Does anyone have a good video they could post a link to? > > Charlie V --__--__-- Message: 4 From: "Curt McCauley" To: Date: Sun, 20 Jul 2008 18:59:38 -0700 Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: training past 40 years of age Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Happy Birthday!! Keep training and call me in about 25 years and let me know how you are doing! (I'll be about 90 then) Curt McCauley Chief Instructor Channel Town Soo Bahk Do --__--__-- Message: 5 From: Ray To: The_Dojang Date: Sun, 20 Jul 2008 20:14:06 -0700 Subject: [The_Dojang] World University TKD Chip Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net U.S. Shut Out of Medals on Third Day of World University TKD Championships July 19, 2008 Dan Chuang Tal Moriah (feather) had the most successful campaign of the day, reaching the quarterfinals. He opened the day with a 7-0 point-gap win over Serbia and followed it with a 4-2 win over China, scoring some strong counters and withstanding a strong flurry from the Chinese player in the third round. Moriah was stopped in the quarterfinals by the eventual gold medalist from Iran. The score in that match was 3-0. Dennis Rudasill (middle) met a tough competitor from Turkey in the first round. While he scored some solid counters, he didn't advance. The final score was 7-2. Sanaz Shahbazi (middle) met Korea, the eventual silver medalist, in the first round. Sanaz managed the match well and landed a number of strong kicks, but Korea prevailed in a very tight match with a score of 2-1. Stephanie Mackay (feather) also met Korea, the eventual silver medalist, in the first round. The match was close throughout the first two rounds with some great exchanges, but Korea was able to pull away in the third round. The final score was 5-1. While the results were disappointing for the team today, spirits remain high and the team is optimistic for the fourth and final day of competition on July 20. Tomorrow, female team captain Darcy Kimmich (welter) meets Chinese Taipei in the first round. Amanda Nissen (heavy) meets the winner of Serbia and Canada in her first match. Christian Valencia (fly) meets Russia in his first match, and Jermaine James (bantam) meets Japan in his first match. Below are the medalists from day 3. For full results, go to: https://webmail.usoc.org/exchweb/bin/redir.asp?URL=http://www.tas.org.yu/wutc2008/results.html Day 3 Results Men's Feather 1) Mohammad Bagheri Motamed (Iran) 2) Soon-Kil Lee (Korea) 3) Christopher Dubois (France) 3) Cesar Mari Puerta (Spain) Men's Middle 1) In-Ho Lee (Korea) 2) Ivan Nikitin (Russia) 3) Ali Sari (Turkey) 3) Ming-Che Yuan (Chinese Taipei) Women's Feather 1) Pei-Hua Tseng (Chinese Taipei) 2) Estefania Hernandez Garcia (Spain) 3) Louz Deborah (Netherlands) 3) Hae-Ree Wang (Korea) Women's Middle 1) Kecui Gu (China) 2) Eun-Seo Shin (Korea) 3) Selviana Angelia Rosok (Indonesia) 3) Anna Kodratieva (Ukraine) --__--__-- Message: 6 From: Kimberley Warner Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] training past 40 years of age, attention Mr. Burns Date: Sun, 20 Jul 2008 23:20:54 -0500 To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net I was a white belt testing for my yellow. I actually broke it warming up hitting a body bag, closed fist, upward punch. My wrist kind of bent funny and I hit the bag really hard. It was one of those freak accident kind of things. I thought it was just a bad sprain so I continued the test. Kept thinking it was getting better and didn't find out it was actually broken until 2 1/2 months later. I just wore a brace and didn't get medical attention which is probably why it didn't heal correctly. My instructor kept telling me I needed to have it x-rayed but I'm a bit stubborn and it didn't seem to hurt all that bad unless I used it. ;.) As for the test that I wasn't allowed to participate in, that was my surgeon's instructions. The second surgery, I had a piece of bone and artery removed from my femur and placed in my wrist in hopes of increasing blood supply (an vascularized bone graft) done at Mayo clinic. The doctor was concerned because a misplaced kick to the thigh or me falling down could have shattered my femur due to the lost integrity of the bone. He wasn't happy at all that I continued in martial arts class but I was very careful and like I said my instructor watched me like a hawk and told me if he saw me doing anything that would risk my recovery I would be sitting on a chair for a year. On Jul 20, 2008, at 9:33 PM, shimmeringlight@optonline.net wrote: > Bows........ > > Im sorry about your wrist.... I am also upset and concerned about > your preparation for test ? > > I have to know, just what test were you taking, was the break on > board(s) or brick(s), and you say it was a closed fist punch ? From > what direction, jab, downward ? ??? > > Have you broken material before ? (with the same techniques?) > > As for my students, they are tested on their overall performance, > which does not mean they have to be compared to everyone else or to > the likes of a, "Bruce Lee" {with due respects}. > > Students that are handicapped, blind, paralyzed, wheel chairs... > can still earn their belts... It is NOT about the test requirements, > it is about the students philosophy and intent - their integrity, > their perserverence and their spirit. > > Were you physically ready... or was this a mishap. Were you > conditioned in 1) Mind, 2) body, 3) spirit ??? > > Hope you are well, and that does not keep your from achieving all > you can be !!! > > Bows !! > > Master gregory nabel > > www.ShimmeringLight.org > > www.GNabelmartialarts.com > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Kimberley Warner > Date: Sunday, July 20, 2008 5:06 pm > Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] training past 40 years of age, attention Mr. > Burns > To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > >> At my first testing I broke a small bone in my wrist (the >> scaphoid) in >> two places. It was a really, really good punch ;.). I was in a >> cast >> for over a year because of some complications and 2 surgeries it >> just >> wouldn't heal. I passed my first test with flying colors, >> tested the >> second time with a cast from my hand to above my elbow. One of >> the >> judges didn't even know I had a cast on my arm during my forms >> until my >> instructor told the judges I couldn't punch with my left hand in >> the >> sparring because of it. >> >> I haven't been able to test since then because the doctor just >> doesn't >> seem to understand the importance of testing for me. I have >> been >> released from his care now so I will be working hard for that >> next >> test. Only missed 2 classes during that year. My instructor is >> a >> Physicians Assistant so he watches me very closely to make sure >> I won't >> re-injure my wrist. >> >> Anyway, I can't tell you the number of people that told me to >> quit. I >> figure the odds of getting hurt badly in TKD class is pretty >> small and >> I've already done that. So getting hurt twice, the odds are in >> my >> favor! >> >> Kimberley >> >> >> On Jul 20, 2008, at 2:16 PM, Mitch Theriot wrote: >> >>> I didnt start until a year ago at age 45. I trained all total >> about a >>> year and a half 25 years ago. Ditto everything Kimberly said. >> I kind >>> of like the little aches as they remind me that I'm not >> sitting on my >>> rump like most of my "old" friends... >> _______________________________________________ >> The_Dojang mailing list, 2,400 members >> The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net >> Copyright 1994-2008: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource >> Standard disclaimers apply >> Subscribe or Unsubscribe: http://the-dojang.net >> > > www.gnabelmartialarts.com > > [demime 1.01d removed an attachment of type text/x-vcard which had a > name of shimmeringlight.vcf; charset=us-ascii] > _______________________________________________ > The_Dojang mailing list, 2,400 members > The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net > Copyright 1994-2008: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource > Standard disclaimers apply > Subscribe or Unsubscribe: http://the-dojang.net > Kimberley Warner AOL IM: xanthepure --__--__-- Message: 7 From: "Thomas Gordon" To: Subject: RE: [The_Dojang] Toi Gye Date: Sun, 20 Jul 2008 23:17:56 -0500 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net The "ITF way" to do this tul can be found at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dXySPEHjwW0 Thomas Gordon Florida --__--__-- Message: 8 Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2008 10:40:06 +0000 (GMT) From: hapkido@optonline.net To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: TKD or Hapkido schools in or very near Montclair, NJ (Christopher Spiller) Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Hi. I see Howard recently mentioned the Iron Eagle Hapkido.. He is most welcome to visit our dojang in Pompton Lakes, NJ to try a free trial class in Jung Ki Hapkido. For information go to hapkidoamerica.com. I would be happy to speak with him personally. Regards, MM Master Michael D'Aloia Korea Jung Ki Hapkido & Kuhapdo Association of America Iron Eagle Hapkido - Jung Ki Kwan 26 Lakeside Avenue (Rear) Pompton Lakes, NJ 07742 (973) 839-9700 hapkido@optonline.net www.jungkihapkidoamerica.com ...Dedicated to the teachings of Hapkido Founder, Choi, Yong Sul and Grandmaster Lim, Hyun Soo > > On Jul 18, 2008, at 2:45 PM, Anthony Zahler wrote: > > > > > I have a former student who is looking for a TKD or > > Hapkido school > > > in the > > > Montcair, NJ area > > > ( Nutley, Bloomfield, west Orange...). He saw a web > > site for Glen > > > Ridge > > > Taekwondo > > > (http://www.grtkd.com/ ) and was curious if I knew > > anything about > > > them. > > > > > > I don't know if happens to any other instructors, > > but I get many > > > requests > > > from current or > > > former students about schools for friends or family in > > other > > > states. While > > > I know a few, > > > having lived in Michigan, Californiaand now the DC > > metro area, I never > > > professed to know > > > about schools in other states. Do any of the other > > instructors or > > > masters > > > here get these > > > types of questions often? I asked and the student > > just assumed that > > > all us > > > TKD and Hapkido > > > masters just know each other and who is good or bad is > > common > > > knowledge. > > > > > > What I did and have done in the past is just explain > > that I will ask > > > other > > > masters and give them > > > the infothat I get from them. I go on to explain that > > it is just a > > > first > > > step and that they should sit > > > and watch a white belt class and, if they can, a black > > belt class. > > > The > > > first to get a feel for how > > > they teach new students and the second to see the long > > term students > > > attitude and skills. > > > > > > Any recommendations would be appreciated, and all > > comments or > > > experiences > > > are also appreciated. > > > > > > Tony Z --__--__-- Message: 9 From: Joseph Cheavens To: Subject: RE: [The_Dojang] Greetings from Temple/Waco, TX Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2008 09:40:08 -0500 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net There is a Relson Gracie association at Baylor. My instructor, Phil Cardella, goes up there from Austin fairl regularly to teach. For more info on Phil and Relson Gracie Jiu Jitsu in Texas: austinjj.com Joe Cheavens> Date: Tue, 15 Jul 2008 11:13:05 -0700> From: maganda44@yahoo.com> To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net> Subject: [The_Dojang] Greetings from Temple/Waco, TX> > Listmembers: know of any good schools in the Temple/Waco, Texas area ? > > Thanks,> > KMcDee> _______________________________________________> The_Dojang mailing list, 2,400 members> The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net> Copyright 1994-2008: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource> Standard disclaimers apply > Subscribe or Unsubscribe: http://the-dojang.net _________________________________________________________________ With Windows Live for mobile, your contacts travel with you. http://www.windowslive.com/mobile/overview.html?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_mobile_0720 08 --__--__-- Message: 10 From: "Gordon Okerstrom" To: Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2008 10:20:47 -0500 Subject: [The_Dojang] Toi-Gye Tul Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Mr. Martin, Thank you for the response. I understood it was a twin elbow strike to the solar plexus / rib cage not to the phyltrum. Very interesting. Also, the fist position is interesting. I would think the main concern is the shape the elbow makes for impact. Twisting the wrist to change the fist position changes the elbow shape and presents different bone and tendon weapons. Also, this is the first time I've heard of changing the speed for demonstration purposes. All good stuff! Thank you. Gordon Okerstrom --__--__-- Message: 11 Date: Mon, 21 Jul 2008 08:48:33 -0700 (PDT) From: Robert Burns To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: The_Dojang digest, Vol 15 #191; From: freddie bishop and Kimberly Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Fred and Kimberly:  I was very fortunate to have spent 12 1/2 years in the Marine Corps, where they emphasized physical training and conditioning; I became a part-time "bench aerobics instructor" at the age of 45, to improve my physical conditioning to perform better doing State and National figure-skating (roller skating) "figures" and"dance"; the 6:00 a.m. aerobics led to problems with my knees and already problematic lower back, which led to my quiting figure skating and limiting my involvment with "Bally's" gym; then, a friend suggested I might try TKD just for the "low-impact" workout, so in Nov. 2001 I joined a local TKD school (OMAC, Indianapolis) and within 4 weeks, I became "hooked" after receiving my 9th GUP Yellow belt, I vowed to become a "Black Belt."  I moved to Crystal River, FL in Jan. 2004, after receiving my 1st Dan, and practiced with a local group of "Black Belts" who later dissolved; but I continued my training alone, except for going back to Indianapolis twice a year for lots of help and encouragement from Gr. Master Young Pyo Choi and the other OMAC (Oriental Martial Arts College) students, who think its "really neat" that a 71 year old is training towards his 3rd Dan, and learning to perform "correctly" a "tornado kick."  I've lost over 25 pounds; gained about 4 pounds of muscle, and my overall health and stamina is equal, if not better than when I was teaching aerobics; Now, if only my hearing, eye-sight and other vital organs would cooperate....LOL!  I encourage everyone to continue and not to give in to the usual desire to "take it easy" or just rest for a few days.  Thats "death" to your conditioning.  Fred, and Kimberly, you can do whatever you choose to do, and DON'T LET ANYONE EVER CONVINCE YOU OTHERWISE.  I've told the younger students, when I go back to Indianapolis for training and refreshers, and for weapons training, that:  "IF I CAN DO THIS, SO CAN YOU, AND SO CAN ANYONE." I hope you will continue on to your Black Belts and since thats just the beginning, continue as long as you possibly can; for me, there is no end to the learning, fun and enjoyment I get from Martial Arts in general and TKD in particular.  I'm also learning "Korean Tai Chi" and Chinese Tai Chi, just for the fun of it and the relaxation and ability to meditate while I'm actually moving my body rhythmically!  Over the years, and especially during my first two years of training, I broke many bones in my hands and feet, and suffered a serious injury to my left eye-socket during competition sparring; some because of poor technique and bad physical conditioning during sparring and HKD throws, and some because I was being used as a "human punching bag" by other students or opponents who had poor technique, etc.  Through it all, I never quit.  NOT EVER...did I consider quitting; instead, I sucked it up as I was taught in the Marine Corps, and healed with new knowledge of how to avoid that type of punishment;  the lessons over the years have helped me become a better instructor to help the youngsters I teach, practice smarter;  SOMETHING THAT ALL GOOD INSTRUCTORS OUT THERE KNOW AND PRACTICE/TEACH EVERY DAY. Moo Do Jung Sin,  Bob Burns 2. training past 40 years of age, attention Mr. Burns (freddie bishop)  Well, I passed a mile stone yesterday. I turned 40 years old! I still have not earn my black belt in anything. So, I missed that boat. My training practice has changed over the years. I try to do things with a little more caution. I have noticed I am less flexible, my butt don't bounce like it used to when I hit the mat, I stay there for a few seconds. The aspects of my training I really enjoy are poomsae, basics practice, I've picked up some weapons techniques, so I enjoy that, and I like studying human anatomy for purpose of applying my tae kwon do more effectively. What has been your experience of training into your 40's and beyond?                                                 Fred I didn't start training until I was 40 so I have no comparison to what it was like before turning 40.  I'm 42 now and absolutely love TKD.  My boys started training 4 years ago.  Sitting and watching just wasn't enough for me so I joined them.  I will never be as quick and strong as they are and wouldn't want to meet my 13 or 14 year old in a dark alley.  My only regret is not starting much earlier.  It has helped my attitude, confidence, health, and over all well being in ways I cannot express. Kimberley --__--__-- _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang Subscribe or Unsubscribe: http://the-dojang.net Old digest issues @ ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com/pub/the_dojang Copyright 1994-2008: Ray Terry and http://MartialArtsResource.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember September 11. End of The_Dojang Digest