Date: Fri, 10 Oct 2008 02:48:22 +0200 From: the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: The_Dojang digest, Vol 15 #272 - 9 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: The Internet's premier discussion forum on Korean Martial Arts. List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Status: O X-Status: X-Keywords: Send The_Dojang mailing list submissions to the_dojang@martialartsresource.net To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net You can reach the person managing the list at the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of The_Dojang digest..." <<------------------ The_Dojang mailing list ------------------>> Serving the Internet since June 1994. Copyright 1994-2008: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Korean Martial Arts. 2,400 members. See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of The_Dojang at http://MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! Today's Topics: 1. I assume this is NK ITF only ??? (Ray) 2. RE: Meet the man who beat Kimbo (Thomas Gordon) 3. Re: Pain Distraction (Jye nigma) 4. Re: Re: Pain Distraction (Ray) 5. Re: Re: Pain Distraction (Thomas Gordon) 6. Re: Re: Pain Distraction (Jye nigma) 7. Re: Re: Pain Distraction (Ray) 8. 2009 US Open (Ray) 9. RE: Re: Pain Distraction (x x) --__--__-- Message: 1 From: Ray To: The_Dojang Date: Wed, 8 Oct 2008 19:10:20 -0700 Subject: [The_Dojang] I assume this is NK ITF only ??? Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Pyongyang to host 2011 World Taekwondo Championships October 08, 2008 Pyongyang, capital city of the Democratic People's Republic of Korea (DPRK), was selected as the host of the 17th World Taekwondo Championships to be held in 2011,the official KCNA news said Wednesday. The decision was made at the 18th ITF General Meeting called in Uzbekistan in September, the KCNA said. The date of the championships has yet to be decided. Pyongyang had hosted the 8th World Taekwondo Championships in 1992. Source: Xinhua --__--__-- Message: 2 From: "Thomas Gordon" To: Subject: RE: [The_Dojang] Meet the man who beat Kimbo Date: Wed, 8 Oct 2008 22:59:42 -0500 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net As to "what this has to do with anything" is the same reason a fan looks into the lifestyle of a fighter. This guy isn't well known in the MMA circles, much less the general public. When I watched the fight and they called his name, I didn't know who he was. As far as the bio, Matt Hughes is a farmer - neat story line. Chuck Lidell apparently likes to party. This guy, well....he seemed to be a bit different than the typical MMA fighter. For whatever it's worth, from his myspace page, he claims to be married and has pictures of his wife. Thomas Gordon Florida --__--__-- Message: 3 Date: Wed, 8 Oct 2008 22:48:47 -0700 (PDT) From: Jye nigma To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Re: Pain Distraction Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net That makes me so mad. I hate the fact that someone who wasn't there can dictate whether a person was a threat or not. Suppose a man has a knife and he attempts to kill a woman. In the process they struggle and let's say she hits him and he stumbles and drops the knife. At that point is this guy not considered a threat? Just because he no longer has a weapon? Sorry for my ignorance of the law, but I'm not too fond of the law anyhow. Because to me, the threat is when someone determines I'm going to be their victim whether they have a weapon or not. The threat to me is their intention, because that intention can be carried out with or without a weapon. Also look at what we as martial artists consider weapons-- extension of our hands, which means we can knock someone off with an extension or with our barehands.   I'll tell you right now, if someone is after me with the intent to harm me, I'm gonna do what I have to do to survive. As long as that person is after me I consider him a threat and that's that. I'd be pissed off if I was in a situation where I feared for my life and had to fight for my life and somebody who wasn't there is trying to tell me how I should have reacted or what I should have done. I see that on the tv court shows all the time. The judge asks them well why did you behave in that manner, why didn't you just walk away. Give me a break. walking away doesn't mean #$%^ you could walk away trying to do the right thing and get your life taken from you. They kill me. Ok I had to vent.   Jye --- aburrese@aol.com wrote: I prosecuted a guy for assault. The incident involved two guys fighting outside a bar one night. During the fight, one guy tripped over the curb and went down with a broken ankle. The other guy then kicked him a few times. The cops arrived and saw those last couple of kicks. The guy then told the cop, "I had to get my licks in." The guy who did the kicking plead self-defense, saying the guy with the broken ankle started it. As the prosecutor, I did not focus on who started the fight. My arguement was that at the time the three kicks were thrown at the guy while he was down on the ground, he was no longer a threat, so those three kicks were not self-defense. That is what I focused on, and he was found guilty because of those kicks, and because when he was throwing those kicks it was no longer self-defense. Also remember, even if you get off of criminal charges based on self-defense, you may also find yourself in a civil lawsuit over the same thing, and the burden is not as hard to prove. --__--__-- Message: 4 From: Ray To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Re: Pain Distraction Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2008 10:27:40 -0700 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net No, not in that situation. The fellow is still a threat if he is attacking, dropped weapon or not. This should be an important part of everyone's training. When is there a threat and when is that threat over? Once the threat is over there is no further need for self-defense, in the eyes of the law... in most states. Ray Terry thedojang@sbcglobal.net On Oct 8, 2008, at 10:48 PM, Jye nigma wrote: > Suppose a man has a knife and he > attempts to kill a woman. In the process they struggle and let's say > she hits > him and he stumbles and drops the knife. At that point is this guy not > considered a threat? Just because he no longer has a weapon? --__--__-- Message: 5 Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2008 14:35:29 -0400 (EDT) Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Re: Pain Distraction From: "Thomas Gordon" To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net I tell our students, "Offense begins when defense ends." Thomas Gordon Florida --__--__-- Message: 6 Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2008 12:06:56 -0700 (PDT) From: Jye nigma Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Re: Pain Distraction To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net My problem is how anyone can determine when the threat is over if they weren't there to see it. Now I understand in a situation like maybe your render the attacker unconcious; then they aren't a threat. But I mean in a situation like you're confronted by a knife weilding attacker, you pick up a pipe, he lunges you knock the knife from his hand. Now the threat is over because he's not armed and now you are. Now if to someone who wasn't there that would sound like the guy is no longer a threat, but what if while you got the pipe in your hand you're telling the attack to leave you alone and he comes at you and you take his damn head off? Now you're the bad guy? That doesn't sit right with me. Jye --- On Thu, 10/9/08, Ray wrote: > From: Ray > Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Re: Pain Distraction > To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net > Date: Thursday, October 9, 2008, 1:27 PM > No, not in that situation. The fellow is still a threat if > he is > attacking, dropped weapon or not. > > This should be an important part of everyone's > training. When is > there a threat and when is that threat over? Once the > threat is over > there is no further need for self-defense, in the eyes of > the law... > in most states. > > Ray Terry > thedojang@sbcglobal.net > > > On Oct 8, 2008, at 10:48 PM, Jye nigma wrote: > > > Suppose a man has a knife and he > > attempts to kill a woman. In the process they struggle > and let's say > > she hits > > him and he stumbles and drops the knife. At that point > is this guy not > > considered a threat? Just because he no longer has a > weapon? > _______________________________________________ > The_Dojang mailing list, 2,400 members > The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net > Copyright 1994-2008: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource > Standard disclaimers apply > Subscribe or Unsubscribe: http://the-dojang.net --__--__-- Message: 7 From: Ray To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Re: Pain Distraction Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2008 13:57:06 -0700 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net No. The threat is not over simply because you have disarmed him. The weapon is not the threat. The person attacking you is the threat. Ray Terry thedojang@sbcglobal.net On Oct 9, 2008, at 12:06 PM, Jye nigma wrote: > But I mean in a situation like you're confronted by a knife weilding > attacker, you pick up a pipe, he lunges you knock the knife from his > hand. Now the threat is over because he's not armed and now you are. --__--__-- Message: 8 From: Ray To: The_Dojang Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2008 13:59:19 -0700 Subject: [The_Dojang] 2009 US Open Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net 2009 U.S. Open Online Registration Available USA Taekwondo October 9, 2008 Online registration for the 2009 U.S. Open in Las Vegas is now available. Paper registration and team registration will be available in the coming days. For the tentative schedule of events and to register online, go to http://www.usa-taekwondo.us/event/event/623 . --__--__-- Message: 9 From: x x To: Subject: RE: [The_Dojang] Re: Pain Distraction Date: Thu, 9 Oct 2008 16:30:41 -0600 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net How about using this approach? Assuming that you have gained the upper hand by disarming or disabling the attacker, you can then make a citizen’s arrest for the assault. If the attacker resists, you may use reasonable force necessary. Most people don’t have a pair of handcuffs available, so there can be some difficulty detaining the arrestee The assault may not have occurred in a safe area and then it may be wise to move the arrestee to a better location while you wait for the proper authorities to arrive (Rot’s of Ruck here). If something like this happens to you when you’re alone and in a dangerous place, you have to be more concerned about surprises. Friends of the arrestee, where the weapon is and how to secure it, spectators that take the wrong side and etc. In that case, I think that I might break his arm (in the act of defending against the knife attack), and beat foot out of there. Mako _________________________________________________________________ Get more out of the Web. Learn 10 hidden secrets of Windows Live. http://windowslive.com/connect/post/jamiethomson.spaces.live.com-Blog-cns!550 F681DAD532637!5295.entry?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_domore_092008 --__--__-- _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang Subscribe or Unsubscribe: http://the-dojang.net Old digest issues @ ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com/pub/the_dojang Copyright 1994-2008: Ray Terry and http://MartialArtsResource.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember September 11. End of The_Dojang Digest