Date: Fri, 16 Jan 2009 02:48:21 +0100 From: the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: The_Dojang digest, Vol 16 #22 - 3 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: The Internet's premier discussion forum on Korean Martial Arts. List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Status: O X-Status: X-Keywords: Send The_Dojang mailing list submissions to the_dojang@martialartsresource.net To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net You can reach the person managing the list at the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of The_Dojang digest..." <<------------------ The_Dojang mailing list ------------------>> Serving the Internet since June 1994. Copyright 1994-2009: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Korean Martial Arts. 2,500 members. See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of The_Dojang at http://MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! Today's Topics: 1. RE: On military pay and martial arts (Bert Edens) 2. RE: Korea etc. (J R Hilland) 3. kkw / wtf / fighting with the hands (David Weller) --__--__-- Message: 1 From: Bert Edens To: "the_dojang@martialartsresource.net" Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2009 11:57:48 -0600 Subject: [The_Dojang] RE: On military pay and martial arts Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Greetings, all... I second the thanks for the service, Mr. McDonough... And if they're a real dojang, they do single-arm curls with those engine blocks... :) *bows* Bert Edens, II Dan TKD Butcher's Martial Arts Springdale, Arkansas -----Original Message----- From: "Jesse Segovia" Subject: [The_Dojang] RE: On military pay and martial arts Ken McDonough wrote: > I spent 25 years in the military, re: Navy and Air Force. Worked 2 > assignments with the Army. Ken, thanks very much for your service to my country and to myself and my family. We honor the commitment soldiers make on our behalf. Yes, perhaps in tough times there are some benefits to working for the government but the military is not the DMV or the IRS. Iraq and Afghanistan should remind all of us that nothing will ever repay the sacrifice soldiers make, or are willing to make, for all of us. And I would love to see pics of the new gym/car shop. Are you going to be practicing your kicks on fenders and doors, or lat pull-downs using engine blocks for weights? :) Jesse --__--__-- Message: 2 From: "J R Hilland" To: Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2009 14:21:03 -0600 Subject: [The_Dojang] RE: Korea etc. Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net <<>> Dakin, we are on the same page. I practiced and taught taekwondo for 20+ years. Stopped testing at 4th dan and even deny that I had anything to do with the art now. I do have some friends who are very talented in the art, they are very 'old school'. For me, it was not a conscience choice, hapkido literally took over and the conflict of the difference in the basic motion between the two arts vanished. BTW, enjoyed your story on your visit to Japan. <<>> I must ask, who told you that? Just a quick internet search shows 30 who claim he gave them 10th dan and 47 who claim Choi Yong Sul gave them a 9th dan. Of course that is not true. I have met over a dozen who also claim 9th dan by Choi Young Sul. Sorry, but my BS alarm is ringing loudly every time I hear a comment like that. Sort of falls under the "hapkido (insert art) is 5000 year old". <<>> Good to hear that you 'earned' your rank. It doesn't get any better. I never saw any hapkido McDojang while I was in Korea. But indeed there are unscrupulous hapkido dojang and, I use the term loosely, hapkido organizations, in Korea that sell dan rank to foreigners from any country. Sadly I have even seen the certificates and been on the mats with them from the south end to the north end of the USA. The first time I saw a paper dan in action was in Wisconsin about 10 years ago at a hapkido seminar. I was flabbergasted. Now I am used to it, I don't like it as I worked hard for my rank, but what are we going to do about it? It is best that we show the 'real art' by example on the mats. --__--__-- Message: 3 From: David Weller Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2009 15:02:52 -0600 To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] kkw / wtf / fighting with the hands Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net OK, I gotta chime in here. Just because a dojang is KKW or WTF affiliated does NOT mean their students can't use their hands. My teacher has some of the fastest hands I've ever seen. When you spar with him, you _better_ have your hands up and you _better_ be watching out for the ol' bread basket because he can generally hit you at will. And a vast majority of the pain he inflicts is with his hands, not his feet. Not that he can't kick, but like he says sometimes, "I have hands too." Sure, when we do tournament sparring we don't hit to the head with our hands (it's against the rules), but I can personally guarantee that every student who learns from my teacher, or from me, is going to keep their hands up in ANY match, regardless of the style. And amazingly we don't do too shabbily against the armless wonders that typify our sport. I'd rather have a student who can make it out of a bar fight alive than one who has a room full of trophies that mean nothing and some big galoot (like Ken's Italian pals) knocks them cold in the first ten seconds of a "real" fight. It's the teacher, not the flag on the wall, that makes the martial artist. Generalizations tend to miss the target. A good back fist probably won't. dave weller On Jan 15, 2009, at 2:59 PM, the_dojang- request@martialartsresource.net wrote: > WTF is not the source for traditional or even self defense > oriented MA. I'll say this, I have my concerns about ITF TKD but if > you cut > off their practitioner's legs they can use their hands. > I've seen WTF TKD stylist step up in full contact competitions > outside of what > they normally do and all of them with the exception of one got > smashed out > BADLY! --__--__-- _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang Subscribe or Unsubscribe: http://the-dojang.net Old digest issues @ ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com/pub/the_dojang Copyright 1994-2009: Ray Terry and http://MartialArtsResource.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember September 11. End of The_Dojang Digest