Date: Sat, 16 May 2009 02:48:22 +0200 From: the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: The_Dojang digest, Vol 16 #132 - 7 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: The Internet's premier discussion forum on Korean Martial Arts. List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Status: O X-Status: X-Keywords: Send The_Dojang mailing list submissions to the_dojang@martialartsresource.net To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net You can reach the person managing the list at the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of The_Dojang digest..." <<------------------ The_Dojang mailing list ------------------>> Serving the Internet since June 1994. Copyright 1994-2009: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Korean Martial Arts. 2,500 members. See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of The_Dojang at http://MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! Today's Topics: 1. Re: Further to this request (Ray) 2. Sorry, wrong guy (Ray) 3. Fw: MILLSTONE POSTURE COMBAT TACTICS (Jye nigma) 4. RE: Fw: MILLSTONE POSTURE COMBAT TACTICS (Christian Briggs) 5. video clip: basic trapping for MMA (Jye nigma) 6. RE: Fw: MILLSTONE POSTURE COMBAT TACTICS (Jye nigma) 7. A local Orlando TKD martial arts studio takes flak. (Tom) --__--__-- Message: 1 From: Ray To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: Re: [The_Dojang] Further to this request Date: Thu, 14 May 2009 17:10:57 -0700 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net But please be sure to indicate where the info came from. Ray Terry thedojang@sbcglobal.net On May 13, 2009, at 4:43 PM, Stuart Anslow wrote: > Ray has already contacted me with the 'okay' (thanks Ray) - Does > anyone have any objections to using interesting news worthy items > published on this list for inclusion into the news section to > Totally TKD magazine (www.totallytkd.com)? I ask, as I feel the > purpose is to share and the magazine is a good forum for that, but i > dont want to upset anyon --__--__-- Message: 2 From: Ray To: The_Dojang Date: Thu, 14 May 2009 17:13:05 -0700 Subject: [The_Dojang] Sorry, wrong guy Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Sex offender? Sorry, but wrong guy Florida Sun Sentinel May 14, 2009 Here's a tale of two Thomas Carpenters who live in Manatee County. One is a former sheriff's deputy who has passed numerous background checks and has made a living protecting the public. Now he's a childrens' tae kwon do instructor. Alas, the other Thomas Carpenter is registered sex offender in Manatee County. He was convicted in 1993 of lewd and lascivious battery on a child under 16 in Sarasota County. You can see where this is going -- and it isn't good. The tae kwon do instructor's reputation took a beating recently when someone sent an anonymous and erroneous e-mail alleging that Carpenter was a state-registered sex offender. "I am writing to inform you that the owner and chief instructor of this facility is a registered sex offender," said the April 18 e-mail, sent to several businesses in the plaza shared by Carpenter's Family Taekwondo. The e-mail was dead wrong. Carpenter isn't a sex offender, and now the sender, if he or she can be identified, could face criminal charges and a civil suit as a result. So all you folks so anxious to hit the send button know: It's a first- degree misdemeanor punishable by a year in jail to misuse information contained in the state sex offender database. Carpenter still runs the studio he's operated for seven years in East Manatee with his two teen-age children and wife, "My wife was a total wreck about it," Carpenter said. "For two weeks, we've been holding our breaths to see how far this has gone." No students have dropped out, but Carpenter worries about losing potential clients. --__--__-- Message: 3 Date: Thu, 14 May 2009 20:01:10 -0700 (PDT) From: Jye nigma To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Fw: MILLSTONE POSTURE COMBAT TACTICS Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EQMiOJO8yZE --__--__-- Message: 4 From: "Christian Briggs" To: Subject: RE: [The_Dojang] Fw: MILLSTONE POSTURE COMBAT TACTICS Date: Fri, 15 May 2009 08:18:45 -0700 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net You always find the good stuff Jye. I enjoy watching the Black Taoist videos. Who is he? Does he teach full time for a living? Just curious, cuase when I watch his vids, he comes off like a guy who is used to teaching people. -Chris -----Original Message----- From: Jye nigma [mailto:kingjye@yahoo.com] Sent: Thursday, May 14, 2009 8:01 PM To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Fw: MILLSTONE POSTURE COMBAT TACTICS http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EQMiOJO8yZE _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list, 2,500 members The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2009: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply Subscribe or Unsubscribe: http://the-dojang.net --__--__-- Message: 5 Date: Fri, 15 May 2009 11:33:10 -0700 (PDT) From: Jye nigma To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] video clip: basic trapping for MMA Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net What do you guys think of these principles? http://www.youtube. com/watch? v=Cw28B_zFa78&feature=channel_ page   Jye --__--__-- Message: 6 Date: Fri, 15 May 2009 11:15:09 -0700 (PDT) From: Jye nigma Subject: RE: [The_Dojang] Fw: MILLSTONE POSTURE COMBAT TACTICS To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net The Blacktaoist is an associate of mine. He's been into the martial arts for quite some time. I don't think he teaches full time, but he's been teaching for quite sometime.   Jye --- On Fri, 5/15/09, Christian Briggs wrote: You always find the good stuff Jye.  I enjoy watching the Black Taoist videos.  Who is he?  Does he teach full time for a living?  Just curious, cuase when I watch his vids, he comes off like a guy who is used to teaching people. -Chris  --__--__-- Message: 7 Date: Fri, 15 May 2009 16:40:45 -0400 From: Tom To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] A local Orlando TKD martial arts studio takes flak. Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Martial Arts or Dark Arts? The Thrill of Victory...the agony of Victory posted by Greg Dawson on May 15, 2009 11:54:07 AM Discuss This: Comments (3) | TrackBack (0) | Linking Blogs | Add to del.icio.us | Digg it My column about the refusal of Victory Martial Arts to cancel a $160-a-month contract after the student - a 5-year-old girl - lost interest elicited passionate reponse from defenders and bashers of the studio. I continue to believe it is wrong - ethically if not legally - for a business to take money for services NOT rendered, contract or no contract. Here is the feeback, verbatim. I, too, am a former student at Victory Martial Arts. I was there from 1998 to 2001. In 2001, I had to quit due to the fact that my finances wouldn't allow me to attend the school anymore along with that, my doctor told me to quit the school too. They didn't want me to break the contract without a doctor's note. When I did present my doctor's note which was straight from the Veterans Affairs Clinic in Orlando, they at first didn't believe me. They ended up calling the clinic to verify that I was lying to them. Here's the thing that really upset me about the school. I managed to make the rank of first degree black belt but in order for me to test for the rank of second degree black belt, they told me that I had to spar in order to earn the rank. I told them that per my doctor, I can't spar because of my medical condition. This is the main reason why I quit the school. Since I left the school, many of the students that trained there with me have also quit too. They claim that the school was charging too much for their services; nowadays, I see some of them working out at one of the local gyms in the area. I'm glad that you wrote the article about this school, it's about time that someone called this school out on their practices. Karen A. Bomotano Winter Springs Florida I injured myself */during/* a Krav Maga class at Victory Martial Arts in Winter Park. Injured the achilles tendon in my right leg. Saw a physician who agreed that this class is not healthy for me and also wrote an excuse for me to turn into the school which stated that I was /not/ to continue taking this or any other martial arts class any longer. They have refused to cancel my membership and they also charged me again after I turned in the note (auto draft out of my checking account) and although they have agreed to refund that months dues, they have not and now I am not getting any response from them at all. See their email to me below. I cannot continue or afford to go to physicians and pay co-pays just to have the same note renewed every month. It clearly stated that I should halt this class immediately, not "take a break". I don't know what to do other than cancel my checking account and maybe go to small claims court with them. Any suggestions? Can this also be posted in the paper. Maybe the publicity will force them into treating people fairly. Also I feel that I was fooled into signing a contract with them. I didn't even know that I was locked into a years contract, I HOPE it was for a year. It was not explained to me. At no time was I told "this is a contract" the only paperwork that I was aware of was the paperwork to allow them to automatically draft my checking account. This is $125 per month. HELP! Jada Sanders I spoke with Mr. Von Schmeling and he said I could refund one month of payments. The doctor's note had to be handed in in February for me to hold March and April. I will refund one payment and also hold the next draft as well. You would have to provide us with another doctors note if you are needing additional time. If you have any questions, please call Mr. Von Schmeling at 407-671-7300. Sandra Velasquez Victory Martial Arts Customer Service Dept. I usually find myself in complete agreement with you, but I take exception to your harsh treatment of Victory Martial Arts in your last two columns. While I agree that holding a five-year-old to a contract to teach them discipline is silly logic, how about holding a parent to a three-year contract to teach them personal responsibility and contract law? When a person signs up for a martial arts class, there are usually several options. At Victory, after a free trial week, I was offered six-month, one-year and three-year options. The longer the contract, the cheaper the price. The key here is that the customer has a choice to make, and it is their responsibility to inform themselves of their choices, weigh their alternatives and make an educated decision. No one holds a gun to their head and makes them choose the three-year contract. It is priced very attractively. The martial arts studio gives up something to gain something. If the customer is foolish enough to opt for the three-year contract up front when enrolling a five-year-old child, then they should have to pay the consequences. A contract is a contract, and the language could not be clearer. People need to understand that when they put their signature to a document, it is a commitment. Victory Martial Arts does not breach the contract; they are ready, willing and able to provide the classes. The customer breaches when they stop attending and then ask not to pay. Would you have a similar answer for someone who signs up for a three-year water filtration service and then decides after three months that they don’t want filtered water? When we signed up my five-year-old for martial arts classes, my husband and I carefully considered the risks versus the price points. We initially signed a six-month contract at $150 a month. At the end of the six months, we were again offered contracts of varying lengths. Having established that my son had demonstrated an ongoing interest in the activity and had received substantial benefits from it as well, we opted for a three-year contract. In so doing, we were given a price of $93 per month, a 38% discount off the six-month price. If my son continues to the end, we will save over $1,000. This discount brings Victory’s monthly charges in line with other programs in the area that provide, to my view, a less professional and rewarding program. This is a calculated risk on our part. We recognize that we may eventually wish to withdraw our son from lessons. We recognize that there is a risk the studio may go out of business. If one of those things happens, we recognize that we will be out some money. Our reward is that we save a great deal of money if we complete the contract. I think that you are misusing your column to hold up Victory Martial Arts and condemn them for doing business by the law. If you have a bone to pick with three-year martial arts contracts, then address the issue generally. Many martial arts studios do business this way. With twelve studios, Victory is the largest provider of martial arts in the area, so it is logical that you get more complaints about them than any other. But don’t do damage to their business in these difficult times by making them a scapegoat. Regards, Tracy Albert Mr. Dawson After reading your article the other day with regard to Victory Martial Art’s I felt a need to retort from a person who has benefited beyond belief from my relationship with Master Von Schmeling and his company. First of all I signed up with Victory personally over 16 years ago when he had one store in Winter Park , after understanding this mans morals and ethics I signed up my youngest daughter Brittany. Brittany is 24 and still takes the self defense course Karav Maga. When we first put her in the class she was an introvert to say the least. Two years ago I watched as my self confident well structured young lady addressed a convention and gave a speech as if she had been doing it her whole life I believe the confidence that she gained from teaching and working with Victory was nurtured from the very first class. There were many times either she or I wanted to just skip a class put it off what ever but I made a commitment to her and she made one to me so we would go, and it was the best decision of my life. Commitment is hard but necessary to any successful person. My daughters are richer persons as am I because of our relationship with Victory Martial Arts and specifically Master Von Schmeling. It is unfortunate that people in the media cooperate with the weakness of our social and economic situation of our country. Socially, no one expects a three or 4 year old to understand about commitment. It is proven that what the child will do is learn to mimic their parents’ action or lack of action. Saying that, every time we are involved to commit our kids to train in good habits, it will take three or more years to teach them these habits by being repetitive and consistent. Even though it might not be the most fun thing to do, if we let our children stop doing things just because they are bored or want to try new things, we just taught them the worst lesson to learn……quitting. Economically, our country’s financial situation is in the shape that it is because people don’t take the responsibilities of their financial commitments. Starting with individuals at the top such as our government.. Also, people using their credit cards or equity loans and not fulfilling their commitments when it comes to payment. It could be because they lost their jobs or received a pay cut, but most of the time, bills are not paid because of consumers being irresponsible knowing they can cry to someone trying to get out of their obligation to pay their debt. That’s where you come in Mr. Dawson. Consumers should pay their debts and stop blaming others by using the media to wash their hands to the responsibilities that they have taken on. This kind of practice, to always protect the consumer even though they are using whatever means to get out of a commitment or agreement, only hurts the small business owners in our country who are the blood stream of our economy. Sincerely Paul Lambert and the entire Lambert Family. Comments The whole financial problem has started due to people not taking the signature on a form seriously. Take a look at any private school contract you pay for the year even if you leave the first day of class without it this and every other company would not have a future. One thing they may want to offer is a cancel insurance that would allow people to insure against total loss like trip insurance. On another note the Victory MA staff and Mr. Von Schmeling are kind people. A young family member had special physical needs that were not covered by insurance but simular to may things found in Martial Arts. Mr. Von Schmeling and his staff worked with us for years to make sure the skills were taught and never lost sight of what they were doing for our family. They could have easily walked away but they helped and we are glad for all they have done. Posted by: R. Spell | May 15, 2009 at 03:16 PM I've never been a student at this martial arts studio. However, from the articles I've read on it, medical doctor's notes are what is required to release these people from their contract. It appears that this martial arts studio is not honoring their end of the contract to the students that provide those notes. Both parties need to adhere to the contract. I hope the students who need to have their contracts cancelled with a medical doctor's note get it cancelled. That is only good business. In the future, don't sign contracts like this. A lot of good martial arts studios are out there that do NOT have contracts. It's strictly pay-as-you-go. If I enroll in martial arts in the future, this is the way I will handle it. Posted by: Amy | May 15, 2009 at 03:42 PM I can't believe what i see in these columns these days! First of All i know greg dawson doesnt have anything better to do then try to get consumers out of paying there responsibilities but he needs to get all the facts if he is going to print something like the tere laakso article. Mr. laakso did hurt his knee at the karate school and victory was willing to cancel even without a doctors note until he went the headquarters in a threatening way demanding to see sandra velasquez. then victory decided fine we want the doctors note. and then when he provided the proper note it was canceled. his approach was completely immature. Then during the whole thing mr. laakso and family goes off telling people telling the instructors make their students pee their pants!!! lol thats funny i was there for that class and the student just had an accident and it was cause he was young and didnt ask to go to the bathroom. so he wanted to cancel his son saying his son was scared to death... likely story! victory martial arts i can say has made me a better person. i understand what it takes to be successfull and i have gained confidence, respect, dicipline, etc. i have been with victory since 1998 and martial arts since i was 5. they are better than any martial arts buissness. that is why there are 12 victory schools here in central florida, 4 in san Antonio, 2 in san jose, and 3 in las vegas. martial arts schools are the number one place to open every year, and the number one to close. some schools do have no contracts but how long have they been open and others have just closed down because no money to pay bills. victory keeps the doors open for 16 years and is the most reliable martial arts out there. CAN ANYONE PROVE ME WRONG????????? Posted by: information | May 15, 2009 at 04:11 PM ------------------ Tom Kennelly 3rd Dan Combat Hapkido --__--__-- _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang Subscribe or Unsubscribe: http://the-dojang.net Old digest issues @ ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com/pub/the_dojang Copyright 1994-2009: Ray Terry and http://MartialArtsResource.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember September 11. End of The_Dojang Digest