Date: Mon, 08 Jun 2009 02:48:22 +0200 From: the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net Subject: The_Dojang digest, Vol 16 #155 - 6 msgs X-Mailer: Mailman v2.0.13.cisto1 MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Errors-To: the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net X-BeenThere: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Mailman-Version: 2.0.13.cisto1 Precedence: bulk Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net X-Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net List-Unsubscribe: , List-Id: The Internet's premier discussion forum on Korean Martial Arts. List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Status: O X-Status: X-Keywords: Send The_Dojang mailing list submissions to the_dojang@martialartsresource.net To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to the_dojang-request@martialartsresource.net You can reach the person managing the list at the_dojang-admin@martialartsresource.net When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of The_Dojang digest..." <<------------------ The_Dojang mailing list ------------------>> Serving the Internet since June 1994. Copyright 1994-2009: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource The Internet's premier discussion forum devoted to Korean Martial Arts. 2,500 members. See the Korean Martial Arts (KMA) FAQ and the online search engine for back issues of The_Dojang at http://MartialArtsResource.com Pil Seung! Today's Topics: 1. RE: Th"ism" (Frank Clay) 2. RE: Fwd: submission (Thomas Gordon) 3. re:chiropractors (hapkidodavetn@aol.com) 4. Tong Il and Chang Hon (healthy inquiry) 5. RE: Fwd: submission (PETER.MCDONALDSMITH@london-fire.gov.uk) 6. RE: Our mark in the community (michael tomlinson) --__--__-- Message: 1 From: Frank Clay To: the_dojang Date: Sat, 6 Jun 2009 10:48:48 -0500 Subject: [The_Dojang] RE: Th"ism" Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Thomas, You couldn't say it better. I believe it should be the responsibility of the parent... but in more primitive cultures it is the responsibility of society as a whole. While I won't say that we should go that route, I will say that Mudo teachers are part of their community and should make a positive impact. But, I think too that this is a topic that may not be needed so much. I can think of no martial arts teacher who does not teach discipline and minor parts of history and culture. People want to know background on things. Some may want to become experts and some are just curious. In every school I've been in (and I've been in a few from east to west coast) some minimal components were common. In some places more than others but it was still done. Too bad it oftentimes isn't done by mommy and daddy. Frank --__--__-- Message: 2 From: "Thomas Gordon" To: Subject: RE: [The_Dojang] Fwd: submission Date: Sat, 6 Jun 2009 10:30:13 -0500 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Mr Brian, Thank you for the post. Apparently my post wasn't clear. The best example is when this couple brought their child in that was literally running down the bench in our foyer and climbing on everything. The child was absolutely unruly. The mom asked the child if he wanted to do "karate" and he slowed down long enough to say "yeah" and then went on his best impression of Jungle Jim using our lobby for his jungle. Mom tells me that she just can't control him and "he NEEDS some discipline." Now I'm thinking I had the Red Fox "I'm coming home" look on my face by this point. Wow! I told them I didn't think we were right for them and referred them to another school. We aren't "most commercial schools" and when we see a child (or parent) that is incorrigible and disruptive to the other students, we invite them to leave. Typically this is about twice a year. The point of my post is, yes, we do teach more than just martial arts. And no, we aren't the parents - we're support role. Wayyyy behind the parents. Thomas Gordon Master's Seminars April 16-18, 2010 www.GordonMartialArts.com/april --__--__-- Message: 3 To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Date: Sat, 06 Jun 2009 20:06:05 -0400 From: hapkidodavetn@aol.com Subject: [The_Dojang] re:chiropractors Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net I have been training in HapKiDo for 6 years (I know not very long) and go to a chiropractor on a regular basis. Not for my back so much as just for regular adjustments, and the the treatment of an occasional injury. In fact I found when I started to do my falls (correctly) I needed fewer back adjustments. David Lepard www.springhillselfdefense.com --__--__-- Message: 4 Date: Sat, 6 Jun 2009 22:35:38 -0700 (PDT) From: healthy inquiry To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: [The_Dojang] Tong Il and Chang Hon Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net   I have a professor that is  a 3rd dan  ITF TKD (though I am unclear as to what branch).  He assigned the topic of Tong Il for a fairly lengthy paper.  I have exhausted all academic sources and most readily available TKD sources.    You name was suggested as someone that would have information that others would not. Tong Il would not have been my first choice for a paper on Taekwon Do since it is in my distant future at the moment.  It was assigned so I will give it my all.  The information on this tul is limited (as it seems to be on most of the blackbelt tuls).  I wish I had better information on everything after Chung Mu. I know the standard definition of Tong Il. Tong Il denotes the unification of Korea which has been divided into two. The diagram  represents the homogenous race. I have the definition of why there is 24 forms. The Reason for 24 Patterns The life of a human being, perhaps 100 years, can be considered as a day when compared with eternity.Therefore, we mortals are no more than simple travelers who pass by the eternal years of an eon in a day. It is evident that no one can live more than a limited amount of time. Nevertheless, most people foolishly enslave themselves to materialism as if they could live for thousands of years. And some people strive to bequeath a good spiritual legacy for coming generations, in this way, gaining immortality. Obviously, the spirit is perpetual while material is not; therefore, what we can do to leave behind something for the welfare of mankind is, perhaps, the most important thing in our lives. Here I leave Taekwon-Do for mankind as a trace of man of the late 20th century. The 24 patterns represent 24 hours, one day, or all my life. The name of the pattern, the number of movements, and the diagrammatic symbol of each pattern symbolizes either heroic figures in Korean history or instances relating to historical events. General Choi, Hong Hi I have academic papers that I can use to support the concept of a unified Korea.  I have non-TKD related information about the Korean homogenous race. I have been told that the certain moves have meaning such as: #1 = 1 Country #2 = Divided #3 Suddenly attacked #38 = Breaking the 38th Parallel. The different stamping moves denotes the frustration over the country being divided. I have been told by different GMs that Tong Il is: 1. The last form and to be considered the last form. or 2. Tong Il is the summation of all of one's TKD training. Several GMs and Masters  have stated that by the time one reaches Tong Il that the importance is not the Taekwon but rather the Do.  One should have the meanings of what TKD stands for and how one should live (be living?). The first of these puts Taekwon Do as a more physical with much more practicality. The second seems to be more of an ethical understanding of what Taekwon Do is (oh, my particular interests is ethics so I may have clouded thinking there  but I have this whole idea about Aristotlean virtue ethics and Chang Hon Taekwon Do but I digress). Do you know anything that I might add?  Did General Choi ever talk about Tong Il either from a practical point of view of how to perform it? or just about  the ramifications of what it stood for? It Tong Il is indeed the totality of one's formal TKD training then is there anything you would add to this idea? or anything that General Choi talked about.  I  have access to most of the books  (Master Mitchell's, Mr. Anslow's, the encyclopedia ...et. al.).  If there is anything else that perhaps I should look into then let me know.  I have to admit that I went through the forum at Kidokwan . I think at this point I am looking for anything that isn't in a book or article (though please let me know of any books or articles that you think I should read) but more of a personal reflection of Tong Il, Chang Hon, or General Choi (in reference to Tong Il  or Chang Hon). Truth be told I would take  any little of sliver of information at this point. I have an understanding of where this paper is going and I am down to the crunch of writing it.  However this is just the beginning of my inquiry into this topic.  I should be testing for my 2nd dan this summer so perhaps this inquiry will take the next  20 years as I work my way toward Tong Il.  I hope you can find the time to respond.       Sincerely       Bill McMillin --__--__-- Message: 5 Subject: RE: [The_Dojang] Fwd: submission Date: Sun, 7 Jun 2009 20:23:07 +0100 From: To: Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net I can see your point. As I said I took up the thread quite late. Students will learn and improve their discipline in the dojang, the same way my discipline has improved since I have been in the fire brigade. Only you can fairly judge whether or not that student is suitable for your dojang. I also respect your comment that you were also thinking of the learning experience of the other students, I wouldn't be fair on them or their fee paying parents. Peter -----Original Message----- From: Thomas Gordon [mailto:tgordon@gordonmartialarts.com] Sent: 06 June 2009 16:30 To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net Subject: RE: [The_Dojang] Fwd: submission Mr Brian, Thank you for the post. Apparently my post wasn't clear. The best example is when this couple brought their child in that was literally running down the bench in our foyer and climbing on everything. The child was absolutely unruly. The mom asked the child if he wanted to do "karate" and he slowed down long enough to say "yeah" and then went on his best impression of Jungle Jim using our lobby for his jungle. Mom tells me that she just can't control him and "he NEEDS some discipline." Now I'm thinking I had the Red Fox "I'm coming home" look on my face by this point. Wow! I told them I didn't think we were right for them and referred them to another school. We aren't "most commercial schools" and when we see a child (or parent) that is incorrigible and disruptive to the other students, we invite them to leave. Typically this is about twice a year. The point of my post is, yes, we do teach more than just martial arts. And no, we aren't the parents - we're support role. Wayyyy behind the parents. Thomas Gordon Master's Seminars April 16-18, 2010 www.GordonMartialArts.com/april _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list, 2,500 members The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net Copyright 1994-2009: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource Standard disclaimers apply Subscribe or Unsubscribe: http://the-dojang.net **************************************************************************** LONDON FIRE BRIGADE For fire safety advice please go to http://www.london-fire.gov.uk/YourSafety.asp To book a LFB workplace fire safety training course go to http://www.london-fire.gov.uk/workplacefiresafetytraining.asp This email intended solely for the addressee and is confidential. If you receive this email in error, please delete it and notify the sender immediately. If you are not the addressee please note that any distribution, copying or use of the information in this email may be unlawful. Email transmissions cannot be guaranteed to be secure or error free as information can be intercepted, corrupted, lost, destroyed, arrive late or incomplete, or contain viruses. The sender therefore does not accept liability for any errors or omissions in the contents of this message that arise as a result of email transmission, including any damage which you may sustain as a result of software viruses. You should carry out your own virus checks before opening emails or their attachments. --__--__-- Message: 6 From: michael tomlinson To: Dojang Digest Subject: RE: [The_Dojang] Our mark in the community Date: Sun, 7 Jun 2009 22:24:43 +0000 Reply-To: the_dojang@martialartsresource.net well actually they don't pay my salary..when they put their students in a different venue their tax dollars goes with them...I don't disdain or declare anything, I stated facts about our program to distill the idea of "public school is somehow inferior to other types of schooling"...I feel it necessary to comment when people start talking about how "bad" public education is ...this is a martial arts message board so when the subject starts heading in the direction of "big government", home schooling, these kids today are bad, etc. then we are venturing in to politics and preconcieved notions so I think I'll fire off a few facts of how things really are, sure I can tell some horror stories BUT the majority of kids are ok today, I love being a public school teacher and feel more comfortable around a couple hundred teenagers than I do around some stuffy adult blowhards that are too serious for their own good..now back to martial arts please.. Michael Tomlinson > > Mr. Tomlinson you declare that the facility you teach from cannot be matched > by any other schooling options. “…and we teach computer graphics, cisco > networking, programming, tv-production, along with all the core subjects being > mixed in using advanced technology. I would love to see a home school, > religious school, or any charter school do the same...” The citizens of your > community that home school, send their children to religious schools, charter > schools, or who have no children at all still pay property taxes. Those > taxes buy you your equipment, furnish you a place to conduct your classes, and > pay your salary. > > As martial arts instructors we need to set the example; we, as men, need to > provide a positive influence in our comminutes regardless of our vocation. > > in His service, > > Rob Wood > > Knowing is not enough, you must apply...Willing is not enough, you must do. -- > Bruce Lee > The path of the Warrior is life long, and mastery is often simply staying the > path. -- Richard Strozzi-Heckler > I am careful not confuse excellence with perfection. Excellence I can reach > for; perfection is God's business -- Michael J. Fox > Si Vis Pacem, Para Bellum > > > _________________________________________________________________ > Windows Live™: Keep your life in sync. > http://windowslive.com/explore?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_BR_life_in_synch_062009 > _______________________________________________ > The_Dojang mailing list, 2,500 members > The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net > Copyright 1994-2009: Ray Terry and Martial Arts Resource > Standard disclaimers apply > Subscribe or Unsubscribe: http://the-dojang.net _________________________________________________________________ Insert movie times and more without leaving Hotmail®. http://windowslive.com/Tutorial/Hotmail/QuickAdd?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_HM_Tutoria l_QuickAdd_062009 --__--__-- _______________________________________________ The_Dojang mailing list The_Dojang@martialartsresource.net http://martialartsresource.net/mailman/listinfo/the_dojang Subscribe or Unsubscribe: http://the-dojang.net Old digest issues @ ftp://ftp.martialartsresource.com/pub/the_dojang Copyright 1994-2009: Ray Terry and http://MartialArtsResource.com Standard disclaimers apply. Remember September 11. End of The_Dojang Digest